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kaschmir's picture
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Joined: 09/14/2016 - 12:10
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Perk and Skill system: Some Input

Hey, to start off: this is my first post on this forum. I am lurking a bit, following the progress that porting Morrowind to Skyrims engine goes through with great interest. Today, I have read that the skill and perk systems are not set in stone yet.

I will not write an essay but come straight to the point. The skill and perk systems in the Elder Scrolls games have some issues, especially since enemies started to scale in strength with character level in Oblivion. Basically, both skill increases as well as most of Skyrim's perks just provide an improvement of the related abilities by some percent points. Especially with scaling enemies, but even without, this is dull- it doesn't alter combat/crafting significantly, offering a relatively repetitive experience. On top of that, many many abilities and spells are downright boring.

Some modders have already touched the issue. One of them stands out: T3ndo and his Perkus Maximus Mod. He has analyzed the shortcomings of the Skyrim perk system and its branches, weaponry, crafting, the magic schools, and spells, and has overhauled them accordingly. He makes many strong points, and his mod improves combat in Skyrim tremendously without altering the general theme or messing with the lore. 
The linked Nexus Mod download page includes an explanation of his approach, his design principles, etc.pp.
It's elegant, and especially mage combat struck me as addictive and far more strategic than before.

Thus: I hope you take a look at this mod before dealing with the skill and perk systems.
It adds so much to Skyrim that it would be a pity if others didn't learn from it and just repeat the original developer's mistakes. Moreover, in my opinion, it changed Skyrim towards Morrowind to some extent, since it reintroduced bigger differences between different weapon classes.
That's all from me. Right now, due to obligations, I can't offer help with the project. Maybe later next year, I will try to enter the team.

Best, Kaschmir


Edited by: kaschmir on 09/14/2016 - 12:39
b8horpet's picture
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Thanks for the input, i think

Thanks for the input, i think we can manage it ;)


BretonMale's picture
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I'd also recommend taking a

I'd also recommend taking a look at this mod called Requiem http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/19281/? Still need to try Perkus Maximus, but as far as the author's older and more popular mod (Skyrim Redone) is concerned I believe Skyrim Requiem is a better overhaul. IMO.

Taerkalith's picture
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We had T3ndo on the website

We had T3ndo on the website here a year or so ago and we were in talks with him regarding suggestions for a design overhaul. We're familiar with his mods, but thanks for highlighting them

Mad God
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There's also a couple of mods

There's already a couple of mods out there that restore the classic attributes/skills system:



Personally I hope you'll try to restore as much as possible from Morrowind's leveling system. Because Skyrim really nerfed everything and made you a jack of all trades :(

Although I would lean slightly more towards the Oblivion system of attributes/skills, because Morrowind did have a few too many skills that Oblivion merged. Such as Long Blade/Short Blade/Axe/Blunt that became Blade/Blunt and Light/Medium/Heavy armor skills that became just light/heavy armor.

But I do think that a more classic leveling system would do the mod good. Otherwise it would just feel like it's Skyrim with new assets, the gameplay is just as important to differentiate this great mod from the base game!

I would certainly love to see a blog post about your efforts to overhaul this :)

MPBunny's picture
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Well I can't speak to the

Well I can't speak to the perks and skills themselves--everyone has their specific desires on how they want the game to run, same as whether or not to have fast travel enabled. However, I've had some thoughts on how the skill menu interface could look like--assuming that it would need to be redesigned along with the other assets in Skywind.  

The perk and skill system in Skyrim being represented by stars and constellations is a good representation with great symbolism. There's a theme and connections between Sovngarde/Aetherius/stars, Kyne, the Thu'um, Skyrim and its aurora...just so many connections that looking to the heavens to determine what you are and can be just fits thematically.  

Morrowind lacks those elements to connect together to make constellations important, instead focusing on the aspects of dreams. Dreams from Azura, dreams from Dagoth Ur, Dagoth Ur's dreamers and ascended sleepers, the unfocused and undefined nature of dreams and their relevance to the many unanswered questions about the events at Red Mountain and the true nature of the Nerevarine--dreaming is a key aspect of Morrowind.  

Therefore it seems worthwhile to change the skill menu to represent this. In the four direction menu where you would look up to the stars and the skill menu and down to look at the map, instead invert it so that you look up to zoom out to the top-down view of the world map, and look down with a eyes-closing screen wipe to the skill menu. The menu background would be filled with indistinct images and swirling mists. Each skill tree would be blurred, with each perk chosen causing it to become more defined, until a full tree has a sharp definition that stands out among the other shapes.

For bonus points the constellations would take the shapes of the old skill symbols in Morrowind.

Mad God
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I think Nexos is already

I think Nexos is already working on those:

Nexos wrote:

Still working on the birthsigns menu.
The lover (I know you guys like this one) and my usual warrior.